When Jesus heard John had been arrested Jesus withdrew to Galilee. .... that makes us
pause and ask why?
Why did Jesus withdraw? Was it a retreat to Galalee? was it an act of caution? a change
in strategy?
Was it an emotional response? A time to be reflective?
Is Jesus regrouping? Were the particular disciples chosen, chosen in response to John
being arrested. (were fisherman particularly courageous people)
Was there a need for John's mission to conclude before Jesus' began?
Withdrew may not be the right word. Was Jesus retreating. Seems like Jesus was instead
launching his mission and moving to Capurnum was a means of doing just that.
How could Jesus withdraw. That statement seems to make sense only if Jesus had
previously been in Jerulalem or Jerrico, more the territory of John. In that case going to
Galalee would indeed be a withdrwaing. If that were the case it might indeed give credence
to claims that Jesus was involved witht he Essene community at Qumran, famous for the dead
sea scrolls.
Teaching, preaching and healing! It seems that the church is glad to include prayers
for the sick but is not really known for healing. Likewise, the church is known for
pushing a certain abount of Bible knowledge and religious doctrines but is not often seen
as a fountain of knowledge or a beacon of enlightenment.
Jesus seemed to have great practical value in the lives of people along the shores of
Galalee. Are we really promoting healing and understanding enough, is there enough
evidence of practical value to support our claim that we are the ones carrying on Jesus'
ministry? Manzel
A friend of mine recently recieve a email from a parishoner. It said she was not
fulfilling the main purpose for preaching and ministry which the email identified as
preaching about sin and salvation.
As Jesus went around Galalee healing the sick of all manor of affliction, praclaiming
good news and teaching about the kingdom of God being at hand, was Jesus giving us a model
for worring about Hell or obsessing about everyone's sin? Was Jesus crusading for people
to make the righte choice; to be on the right team so that ther would be healing and good
news or was Jesus loving people in their brokenness with no strings attached? Was that the
Good new? MANZEL
Much has been written in recent weeks about how the LIBS AND THE CONSERVS seem to FIGHT
with each other too much on this site... perhaps that's true... I'm not threatened by
that, do I like to see it? Why not? A little good discussion never hurt anyone...
I've had persons leave the church because I was too LIBERAL... for them...
I'm sure LIBERALS have left churches too... still, my point is this... why do we all
have to agree on theology...
We're ALL created in God's image right? So, if I interpret the scripture different than
you, am I a bad person... certainly not... any more than you're a bad person because I
disagree with yours...
It takes all of us interpreting the scripture... DAY BY DAY... to bring about God's
gift to the world. You might reach someone I will not, and I may reach someone YOU may
not. Together we can make it a better world, a larger world of FAITH.
God uses us all and shares that gift to the world. The gift of peace and loving our
neighbors as God loves us...
Most of you may have seen this quote from Dr. Martin Luther King Jr... it seems rather
timely... give the situation in the world today.... It is excerpted from "Loving Your
Enemies", a sermon delivered on 17 November 1957 at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church in
Montgomery, Ala.
ML King Jr. said... of conflict...
"I think the first reason that we should love our enemies, and I think this is at
the very center of Jesus? thinking, is this: that hate for hate only intensifies the
existence of hate and evil in the universe. If I hit you and you hit me and I hit you back
and you hit me back and go on, you see, that goes on ad infinitum. It just never ends.
Somewhere somebody must have a little sense, and that?s the strong person. The strong
person is the person who can cut off the chain of hate, the chain of evil. And that is the
tragedy of hate, that it doesn?t cut it off. It only intensifies the existence of hate and
evil in the universe. Somebody must have religion enough and morality enough to cut it
off, and inject within the very structure of the universe that strong and powerful element
of love."
Blessings, pulpitt in ND
pulpitt in ND: You sound like what we are supposed to believe in the Christian Church
(Disciples of Christ). However, it sickens me when the conservatives and the liberals,
alike, are intolerant of the views of others. It makes me think of something radio
psychologist Dr. Laura said once. "What is more important - your relationship, or
being right?" I think for too many people, it is being right. Why can't we be
Christians and supportive of the right of people to have their own opinions? I am one of
those fence sitters - sometimes I am liberal, sometimes conservative. Some would say that
is an aweful place to be. PH in OH
I just read the comments to date here...and then went to the Epistle passage for this
week. It seems that Paul was also bothered by "factions" in the Body......
I don't mind differences of opinion at all...but at times when people get so...angry
behind differences on these pages....it is troubling. I am having difficulty picking
scriptures..and need to get going early this week, as we have our leadership retreat
Friday and Saturday...(no time for a desperate preacher to cram it all in at the end of
the week.....) Hopefully the comments will flow a bit early this week.
I feel that I have preached these passages before....and would like to breathe fresh
air into them this time around....
Just thinking outloud...
Jude in Wash
Jesus left the territory of herod and went to the territoy of his brother Phillip
because Herod had sent word that he wanted to see Jesus and Jesus saw how he had just seen
John. So jesus goes to a more friendly and receptive territory. By the way Pulpitt, Jesus
saie there is a way that seems right unto a man but thge end there of is death. We better
be very careful how we interpret the scriptures it is not allright to interpret them as we
please.
Harold in Alabama
Jesus called these men to be His disciple - so what is a disciple? In the process of
studying our spiritual gifts and the ministry that God calls us to - a young mother shared
her frustration. She wanted to respond to whatever ministry God called her to - yet she
couldn’t see at all how she would have time for anything else and with 3 youngsters
under the age of 5 - there was little she could take off her plate. I was reminded of this
when I read an article in Christian Century by Dallas Wallace titled “How to be a
disciple.” He draws the analogy of a disciple being an apprentice. “For a
disciple of Jesus is not necessarily one devoted to doing specifically religious things...
I am learning from Jesus to live my life as he would live life if he were here. I am not
necessarily learning to do everything he did, but I am learning how to do everything I do
in the manner in which he did all that he did. I am learning from Jesus how to lead my
life, my whole life, my real life.” No matter what our ‘main occupation,’
we learn from Christ how to live that position. Everything from being a mother, a research
scientist, a professor, a dairy farmer, a student, a retired army general and the list
goes on. How would Jesus live this life of mine? So a disciple is someone learning from
Christ how to live his or her life - His way. Incorporating Christ in all hours and facets
of our life. I hear the confusion about discipleship in many ways, don‘t you?
That’s the minister’s job - ministers do God’s work full time - lay people
are part-timers, they have to do God’s work on their days off or after hours. Oh to
clear up this misconception..... just being to think here. Glad too that ya’ll are
starting early. It’s a great help. mitcavis
Part-time disciple? What about a title: When are you a Disciple? Glad to see action
early. Thanks to all for last week. Nancy-Wi
A very important part of this scripture is that Jesus called these men, not because
they were disciples, but to BECOME disciples! None of these dudes really proved themselves
while Jesus was with them, it was later that all that Jesus had taught them jelled. I have
been called to "become" and I will have to work all my life at that.
I do have a question, this week in John, we preached that Andrew was a disciple of John
the Baptist and he brought two of his disciples (Andrew was one) to Jesus and they became
his disciples, then, Andrew brought his brother Simon to Jesus. I preached on the
evangelism aspect. Now, this week we have the Matthew passage where Jesus calls these two
men from fishing. How do I do this???? I am thinking it might be easier just to pick
another scripture! Except, I would really like to go with the theme of being called to
become. Toni in WV
Harold - I know Prov. 14:12 says "there is a way which seems right, but..."
Did Jesus quote that at some point? I remember him saying, "I am the way..." but
not that. It seems to me that interpreting the Scriptures in light of the life and
ministry of Jesus (the Way, and the Word) might be our only hope. In other words, if I
interpret them in such a way that I am judgmental and unloving, am I really being true to
the Word and the Way? Just thinkin' And, I noticed that the first few postings didn't have
names. It's helpful to know how to respond, so could y'all attach at least initials?
Thanks. Also - Can we get back to the passage for this week and hop off the lib vs.
consev. jag? Seems to me we're on the same team already...haven't we left our nets to
follow Jesus? Just thinkin' NBC Preacher
Toni ... you don't need to reconcile this account with John's account. Remember, the
Gospels are not "histories" the way we moderns think of them. John and Matthew
were working in different communities with differing oral traditions. Each had remembered
the way in which the disciples came to follow Jesus in a different way. Memory is like
that... the essential fact -- that they came to follow Jesus -- is maintained, but the
penumbra of surrounding details is changed through the several years of telling and
retelling the story until John in his community and Matthew in his finally write it down.
Just explain that to your people and you don't need to feel uncomfortable with the
differences between the two Gospellers' accounts.
Blessings, Eric in KS
I think I am going to tie together two things that Jesus says in this passage -- repent
and follow. Too often, there are people who repent (so they think) without following
Jesus, or they follow Jesus (so they think) without repenting.
OLAS
Toni in WV, Eric in KS is right of course, these stories are from different books,
written by and for different folks in differing settings, but...
While I don't usually feel compelled to justify the gospels, in this instance I feel it
actually helps. Stick with me, there's a lot of 'what-if' quality to this. I wouldn't form
any doctrines or dogmas on this interpretation, but here goes-
In John's account, Jesus does not call Andrew. Andrew follows on John's testimony, then
brings Simon, also uncalled by Jesus. If you go on(Jn.1:43) Jesus does call Philip, making
Phil, not Andrew or Simon, the first called disciple. Philip goes and gets Nathaniel and
Jesus says some neat things to him too, but doesn't call him, per se. But next, Jesus and
his disciples(plural) go to Cana for a wedding, so maybe Nathaniel, and Zeb's sons were
following, but maybe not.
Anyway, this initial meeting with Andrew and Simon down around the Jordan would explain
Matthew's account of the encounter on the seashore. It seems like an abrupt commision from
a stranger, but maybe this is a re-encounter with someone already familiar, now finally
calling them to follow. John's story actually makes Matthew's easier to believe, not
harder. Can't say for sure, but it makes sense to me.
mitcavis, wow!, thanx! That view of discipleship definitely makes sense to me. How
would Jesus live out the life of love if he were, say, a mother of three instead of a
single carpenter. He did live a specific life in a particular place and time, as do we.
Good stuff.
O.K., here is what I'm thinking at the moment, about preaching. Just a nugget of
thought so far. Jesus withdrew from Jerusalem when the tide turned against John's kind of
theology, which Jesus shared. If he stayed, probably he would be next. BUT, he didn't run
back home to Nazareth, except to pack up and go to Capernaum. We often fail or face
trouble and give up and go home. Jesus set out for a new frontier. Somewhere between the
danger of confrontation and the comfort of cacooning is the promise or potential for
meaningful ministry. Where to go from there? Help me if you can... tom in TN(USA)
Great! Good to know I'm still on speaking terms with y'all (haha)
Just because it ties in with so much that's gone on in my and my church's life lately,
I'm going to take the EXCELLENT suggestion that someone, uh, suggested, several posts ago:
"What's in your net?"
Sometimes I identify with Matthew! He's hands-on and impatient. He calls for a decision
that we can stick with, by which we can immerse the rest of our lives into membership in
Christ's Body. Few are as intense as he is, but if your decision isn't an all-body,
all-soul commitment, is it much of a commitment at all? Are we in or out?
How few of us are ready to leave our nets! An e-mail conversation with one of my own
best friends brought this all up: I'd told her that if every member gave only $75.00 a
month, we'd have a $5,000 surplus in the budget by the end of the year. She wrote back,
"After bills and everything else, there is nothing left for charity. I gave $40.00 to
the church that baptized Mikie a couple months ago." I don't know what disturbed me
more, that the church is designated a "charity" (I even try to work without
turning on the heat), or that she found the money to take her sons to go see "Toy
Story 2 on Ice." Yet, my salary is "charity?" My kids' food and clothes are
"charity" to be funded from left-overs?????
Same goes for UM preachers who won't itinerate.
Anyways, I'm praying for grace, and I think I can form a pretty straightforward
discipleship sermon. Any good examples or illustrations from anyone (I don't think I'll
use the one I gave above).
Sally in GA
Toni in WV pointed out that Jesus didn't call these men because they were disciples
already, but to become disciples. I'm preaching about "going on to perfection"
(can you tell my tradition?!). We are called to be learners of Christ's way of life, and
then to share that way of life with others. We are not perfect. The disciples were not
perfect. They all left him at the cross. James and John asked to be first. Yet their
sharing of the way of a disciple changed the world. But,as someone else said, they also
ACTED. They didn't just show up for the Sermon on the Mount, tell Jesus "good job
this morning," leave and not do anything about their Christianity until the next cute
story. They LIVED the life of a learner, always learning, maybe getting an answer wrong
here and there, maybe not completely understanding the concept the first time, but they
never gave up trying.
Just thoughts.
RevJan
