Scripture Text (NRSV)
Jeremiah 18:1-11
18:1 The word that came to Jeremiah from the LORD:
18:2 "Come, go down to the potter's house, and there I will let you
hear my words."
18:3 So I went down to the potter's house, and there he was working
at his wheel.
18:4 The vessel he was making of clay was spoiled in the potter's
hand, and he reworked it into another vessel, as seemed good to him.
18:5 Then the word of the LORD came to me:
18:6 Can I not do with you, O house of Israel, just as this potter
has done? says the LORD. Just like the clay in the potter's hand, so
are you in my hand, O house of Israel.
18:7 At one moment I may declare concerning a nation or a kingdom,
that I will pluck up and break down and destroy it,
18:8 but if that nation, concerning which I have spoken, turns from
its evil, I will change my mind about the disaster that I intended to
bring on it.
18:9 And at another moment I may declare concerning a nation or a
kingdom that I will build and plant it,
18:10 but if it does evil in my sight, not listening to my voice,
then I will change my mind about the good that I had intended to do to
it.
18:11 Now, therefore, say to the people of Judah and the
inhabitants of Jerusalem: Thus says the LORD: Look, I am a potter
shaping evil against you and devising a plan against you. Turn now,
all of you from your evil way, and amend your ways and your doings.
Comments:
God teaches Jeremiah a lesson at a potter's shop. Just as a potter is
able to destroy an unacceptable vessel, starting over to refashion it
into one of value, so God molds and fashions nations, including
Israel.
What has happened to our ability to see, to pay attention, to
contemplate what is before our eyes. This is what Jeremiah did, as he
observed the potter he thought about YHWH's relationship with his
people. Prophecy is grounded in the here and now. What should we be
paying attention to?
tom in ga
We had a HUGE debate about whether God changes God's mind in a Bible
study... our predestinarian friend couldn't get her mind around it and
could only conclude that God would change God's mind only if it would
fit into God's "plan."
Sally in GA
Note: "Isa 64:7 There is no one who calls on your name, or attempts to
take hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us, and have
delivered us into the hand of our iniquity. 8 Yet, O LORD, you are our
Father; we are the clay, and you are our potter; we are all the work
of your hand. 9 Do not be exceedingly angry, O LORD, and do not
remember iniquity forever. Now consider, we are all your people." The
theme of remaking the faithful... the covenant people... is a popular
one for the prophets. The image of the potter and the clay is used at
lerast twice! I always admire someone who is able to take the
pieces...the left overs and make something new and useful and
wonderful out of them!
How wonderful to hear this after last weeks message from Jeremiah that
the people have abandoned God. Our God wants to take us and remold us.
WOW!
I am anticipating in every moment what God might make of us from the
pieces that are in us. Have thine own way dear Lord! Terry in Ohio
I can just see Jeremiah going down to the potter's and watching him
work. Jeremiah must have wondered what YHWH had in mind as he stood
there admiring the artistry of the potter. Seeing the vessal turning
and then horrified as the flaw from the inside come outside. Clearly,
the lesson is hard for Jeremiah to see. I will start over and remove
the flaws.Judgement and grace. Padresac
tom in ga--
i like your connection between jeremiah's being directed to go and see
something happening in order to hear the word, and our needing to pay
attention to something in order to do the same. all kinds of examples
come to mind of vessels that are spoiled or not doing what they're
supposed to be doing--i guess i think especially of the ones that are
supposed to take care of and stick up for children, whether families
or governments, etc.
i took a pottery class in college, and while i didn't get all that
good at it, it was an experience i continue to draw upon, 20 years
later. in order to make a clean balanced pot, you've got to exert
serious, steady pressure from opposing directions, and all the clay
has to be pressed into a form that spins evenly around the center
axis. clay that gets off center gets grabbed by centrifugal force and
spins farther and farther out, until it flies off and across the room!
the best pieces that bore my name were the ones where the teacher had
reached around me to straighten out some thick or lumpy part with her
sure hands.
just ruminations--
laura in TX
The New Jerusalem Bible has, for verse 4, "But the vessel he was
making came out wrong, as may happen with clay when a potter is at
work. So he began again and shaped it into another vessel, as he
thought fit." Of course, it's only Monday, and I'm still meditating on
this passage; but, I'm preparing for a Communion Sunday. Perhaps this
is a good image for the Lord's Supper -- even when the potter is
working us, we may come out wrong. So, we submit ourselves to be
reshaped. MTSOfan
I am struck by the way that unfired clay can still be remade. while
once it is fired, there is nothing to do with a defective vessel but
to break it. This passage may have in it an element of hope. Israel is
still pliable, all is not lost.
I am using the passage, connecting with Labor day-work We will be
wearing work clothes to church...I get to wear blue jeans to preach
in...
I am going to visit my mom in WV this week, Jeff Diehl , potter that
sells his wares at TAMARACK, near Beckley. Is near my mom, I think, I
will visit his place, ask if he will throw a pot...watch like Jeremiah
did, I might get brave enough to ask to let me try, my pot may look
bad...but I think I will take it with me to use in sermon...I may go
to the dollar tree here and get a pottery piece to break on the floor,
wake em up huh? VISUALS teach...
The only thing the last verse here GOD fashioning evil? God cant be
around sin-evil. this confuses me a little... I think it equates with
judgement...
Clerically Blonde in West Ohio
Hi DPs! I read this site often, but rarely post. However -- as a
pastor and a potter -- this is a text I especially look forward to
wrestling with -- as does my congregation. We will move the pulpit and
put my wheel in its place -- and I'll preach while throwing pots. (Too
fun!) Anyway -- since a lot of you will be trying to draw parallels in
this text -- I thought I'd offer help. If you have specific questions
about the process -- feel free to email me and I'll try to help. Joy!
- ks dancingfiddler@mac.com
Sermon title, "Have you been fired?" Refer to popularity of the
"reality" show where Donald Trump weekly fires somebody and they are
through, out of the running,off the show. Why do we enjoy seeing
people "voted off the island?" Could you sell a show where folks fail,
are encouraged and given another chance? God says the failed pot will
get re-thrown. You can keep trying to work the clay as long as it is
pliable. When it dries out, re-wet it. It is only lost after it has
been "fired" in the heat of the kiln(oven). Do we "fire" people we
know; assume they are set and can't change? Is it because in our minds
we have already assigned them to the blazes of Hell? "Your fired! Get
out of my sight." Why are WE so hard? Paul writes to Philemon to
suggest a runaway slave has been re-worked into a useful servant of
Christ (and Paul) and could be of service, if only Philemon will give
him a second chance. "God never changes" it is said, but Jeremiah
shows a God that continues to work in new ways with fallen humankind
to get a good result. Are we willing to look anew at folks God hasn't
given up on yet? Or, in our minds, have we "fired" God into a hardened
inflexable rod to beat one another with? Maybe life has dried us up,
but God will apply water and soften and rework us if we allow. Some
early thoughts, tom in TN(USA)
Dancing Fiddler,
Do flaws in the pot always come from the inside?
PJ
PJ - Not at all. Flaws can come from anywhere! But -- if the pot is
not 'centered' -- it will hugely affect the outcome...sometimes that
is a creatively wonderful thing. However --air bubbles, dried clay,
etc. can affect the structure as well -- but not always 'from the
inside' ... It is more the preparation -- making sure the clay is
properly prepared (i.e. wedged) and then centered. 'hope this helps.
--Dancing Fiddler
Here's a lump in our clay: YHWH is "like a potter, shaping evil..." We
tend to think of ourselves as clay in the hands of a benevolent
potter, but that's not the imagery here, is it? This potter has bad
intentions for this bad clay. -Dale in Chattanooga
Dale -- OR ... 'shaping evil' into what? ... that part is not
clear...the text just throws out options but not definitive answers as
I read it. I have worked with some really cruddy clay that needs to be
broken down, reworked with other clay bodies, etc. to be of use. I've
worked with other clay that seemed cruddy (i.e. "evil" - for
metaphorical purposes) ... and found that in working it, shaping it,
caring for it-- it wasn't so 'evil' after all ... but -- it required
of the clay some openess to be re-formed. 'just some thoughts to widen
the discussion... -- DF
Tom in TN,
Thank you so much for your words -- you've helped me to solidify where
I think I'm being led with this sermon. There is so much to work with
in the lectionary passages this week, so many overlaps, some places
where they don't mesh at all. Ah, hard to get back into the groove
again after vacation.
fc
Tom in TN,
ouch! But thanks. There are so many people that we can so easily
discard in this life, when God always has the love and the endurance
to reshape us.
I also think that this passage blends very nicely with the gospel
lesson. Counting the cost, and alllowing ourselves to be reformed in
the hands of God.I am so conscious of the difficulty of discipleship,
and maybe we just toss things off too easily, before we truly submit
ourselves to God. Susan in Wa.
Tom in TN, when I first saw your "Have you been fired?" I thought of a
pot being "fired" with glaze to seal it and to make it new and shiny.
(or is that ceramics.) Anyway it made me think about how God accepts
our imperfections and helps us to use them and make them better in our
lives just like we look at a piece of work and even though it may have
imperfections, someone will love it and allow it to be used. It
reminds me of the story that Joyce Meyer tells of the teacup starting
out as clay and then becoming a cup and saucer that someone really
wants. Just late musings since I am up this late/early in the a.m. in
Texas. (2:48 a.m. that is.)
TA in TX
Jeremiah... v. 18:4 says, "The vessel he was making of clay was
spoiled in the "potter's hand", and the potter reworked it into
another vessel, as seemed good to him."
It's interesting to me (and our study group) that the potter spoiled
the "clay" and that the "potter" worked it into another vessel. GOD
DID NOT THROW IT AWAY, GOD DOES NOT FORECLOSE... THERE IS ALWAYS HOPE!
I like that!
pulpitt in ND
MTSOfan: I too am seeing tie-ins w/ communion. I think of how the
grape and wheat are reformed for God's communication with us. How do
we respond? ... in tight bundles of self-defined ideology, or are we
open, moldable, willing to be re-formed, re-newed, red-deemed? Jesus
himself said "This is my body, BROKEN for you." Blessings Rev.Pam
I am reminded that Jeremiah is talking to the PEOPLE... not to
individuals. How does that tie in to how Christendom is living our
call right now? US Christianity? Where are our flaws? Certainly the
politicizing of Christianity during this election has some grist for
the mill. Blessings, RevPam
