11:26 When the wife of Uriah heard that her husband was dead, she
made lamentation for him.
11:27 When the mourning was over, David sent and brought her to his
house, and she became his wife, and bore him a son. But the thing
that David had done displeased the LORD,
12:1 and the LORD sent Nathan to David. He came to him, and said to
him, "There were two men in a certain city, the one rich and the
other poor.
12:2 The rich man had very many flocks and herds;
12:3 but the poor man had nothing but one little ewe lamb, which he
had bought. He brought it up, and it grew up with him and with his
children; it used to eat of his meager fare, and drink from his cup,
and lie in his bosom, and it was like a daughter to him.
12:4 Now there came a traveler to the rich man, and he was loath to
take one of his own flock or herd to prepare for the wayfarer who
had come to him, but he took the poor man's lamb, and prepared that
for the guest who had come to him."
12:5 Then David's anger was greatly kindled against the man. He said
to Nathan, "As the LORD lives, the man who has done this deserves to
die;
12:6 he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing,
and because he had no pity."
12:7 Nathan said to David, "You are the man! Thus says the LORD, the
God of Israel: I anointed you king over Israel, and I rescued you
from the hand of Saul;
12:8 I gave you your master's house, and your master's wives into
your bosom, and gave you the house of Israel and of Judah; and if
that had been too little, I would have added as much more.
12:9 Why have you despised the word of the LORD, to do what is evil
in his sight? You have struck down Uriah the Hittite with the sword,
and have taken his wife to be your wife, and have killed him with
the sword of the Ammonites.
12:10 Now therefore the sword shall never depart from your house,
for you have despised me, and have taken the wife of Uriah the
Hittite to be your wife.
12:11 Thus says the LORD: I will raise up trouble against you from
within your own house; and I will take your wives before your eyes,
and give them to your neighbor, and he shall lie with your wives in
the sight of this very sun.
12:12 For you did it secretly; but I will do this thing before all
Israel, and before the sun."
12:13a David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the LORD."
Greetings all
Because last Sunday was children Sunday, I did not preach on this
important incident in the Deuteronomist's history, showing that when
we do right, God is pleased, when we do wrong, God is not pleased.
This was important as the Jews came out of exile. I want to look at
this from a 21st century spiritual need. Of course much will remain
the same, but knowing now the importance of every person, and their
equal involvement, I want to equally look at David, Bathsheba, Uriah
and Nathan. The title is Choice and power(or preference and
potential)
Shalom Pasthersyl
For anybody preaching on this passage and who can make use of video
in your service, I highly recommend the Veggie Tale video "King
George and the Ducky". There is a segment in which the prophet tells
the story Nathan tells, by singing it. (It's also a great
salute/poke regarding flannelgraphs.)
I did something last week I rarely do: I left my congregation, with
David, entrapped in his sinful plan. Now, this week, I'll preach
"the rest of the story!" This series from II Samuel provides a rare
opportunity to contrast the snare of sin with the freeing power of
God's grace. Ken in WV
In some ways this text is more difficult to preach about than last
week's! We don't get very far into David's repentance or the
consequences of his sin, but we do catch a glimpse of a rare moment
- that moment when someone sees the truth about him/herself. Most of
the time we don't see our sinfulness, our participation in
corporate/institutional sin, our own pettiness and prejudices. It is
a terrible moment, but I guess it's also a moment of grace when God
allows us to see ourselves as we are: for in seeing the truth about
ourselves, we begin to see our helplessness and our own need for
repentance and change. Sometimes grace is a little uncomfortable.
CSS
My sermon last week on the David passage also left people with the
truth of David's sin... and essentially the message was that we are
all one choice away from going down the road David did.
I must agree that this is a great opportunity to emphasize that
moment of realization of sin. And it's not only realizing that we
have sinned, but recognizing that we have sinned against God. My
message this week will be emphasizing that ultimate question in sin
is whether or not we choose to love, obey, and serve our God.
We can try to give all sorts of nice-sounding justifications to our
sin, but it is still sin. It hurts us, it hurts others, and it hurts
our relationship to the God who made us. (Sorry if I'm starting to
sound like I'm preaching. That's a danger of contributing when my
sermon is still this early in the formative stages.)
I'm considering doing this as a first-person narrative from Nathan's
perspective. I think that could work very well.
If you want a more dramatic scripture reading, I've discovered that
the 2 Samuel pericope makes a great intercalation with Psalm
51:1-12. Just do this . . . Reader One: 2 Sam. 11:26-12:8; Reader
Two: Ps 51:1-3; Reader One: 2 Sam. 12:9a; Reader Two: Ps 51:4-5;
Reader One: 2 Sam. 12:9b-12; Reader Two: Ps. 51:6-11; Reader One: 2
Sam 12:13a; Reader Two: Ps 51:12. MTSOfan
Last Sun. I preached about the choices we make and whether we make
God based or self centered choices. A God based will keep us in
God's will or purpose for our lives and a self centered ie. David's
will lead us through temptation searching for God in our lives. This
Sun. I will continue that line with Nathan helping David see his
justification (killing Uriah) as a self centered, fear based
decesion and now searching for God and forgivness. Tying in the
gospel with Jesus saying to the people you are not looking for me
but for the bread you ate. We should be looking for Christ and not a
loaf of bread but the bread of life! It is the bread of life that
brings us into unity and friends/prophets like Nathan that often
help us on earth seek that unity. SL in AL
Hi all,
A couple of things I've come across in my reading and thinking.
Nathan's parable is like a trojan horse. Normally, we would never
let an enemy army inside the gates. Our defenses are up, ready to
fight off any encroachment. But somehow,the trojan horse is cute
enough, it grabs our attention, we open the gate and bring it in.
But then we discover that the enemy has cleverly hidden themselves
inside and now we are helpless against the onslaught.
When a prophet tells the truth, he is able to somehow penetrate the
defences that we have so carefully constructed against outside
intrusion. We all delude ourselves in numerous ways. We all have
dark corners where the truth doesn't shine. In those dark places, a
direct assault does nothing. Logical arguments, denominational
position papers, boatloads of scripture, these are insufficient to
break through the walls we have constructed. It takes a Nathan with
a trojan horse to bring us back to our best selves and to God.
Shalom, Larry cny
Hi all, I am considering doing a first person sermon from the eyes
of David. I want to talk about David's love for God and strong
desire to do what was right in the sight of God and of how this sin
crept in, like a previous poster said, "like the Trojan horse." Even
in killing Uriah, David was trying (in his own warped since of
reality) to do the right thing by marrying the mother of his child.
He just kept getting trapped in his own web. I think most, if not
all, can identify with trying to live a good and just life but
getting side tracked and maybe the greatest sin is thinking that our
behavior is consistant with our Christian belief. The recognition of
his own sin may have been the greatest gift of grace David received.
My initial struggle with this first person idea is that I am female,
and if I am consistant with the text, it may sound like a lesbian
relationship and distract my congregation from hearing the true
points that I am trying to convey. Any suggestions? JRinBigD
to JRinBigD - i, too, am female, and have done a number of
first-person narratives from the perspective of men in the
scriptures. all it takes is a clear identification of yourself,
early on, as David, and the story can unfold from there. it may also
help to let a few folks - deacons? - in on what you are doing before
sunday morning, especially if this is the first time you've tried
it. just like david, people in the pews often hear "stories" told to
them in the first person much more clearly than they hear
traditional "preaching." God bless! nwolc/ct
I've been in the background reading for several months. My preaching
has improved with the help of you grand preachers!
Sunday my sermon title is What You Deserve. If I got what I'd
deserve I would be very unhappy. David didn't get what he deserved -
Thank God! I hope to focus in on the thought that we deserve
nothing. Every thing we have is a free gift from God. Simple and
straight forward. It will be communion so the gift of salvation and
forgiveness will be front and center. mcp
Hey. I'm first time and like it. Great points. Go for the first
person sermon or even a dramatic monologue by dressing the part.
What are you going to do with the curse that God gives David? Just
let it speak for its self. Sin cost more that we want to pay and
carries us farther that we want to go.
Dan (boxflash@hotmail.com)
I think I'm going to start (at least thinking about it this late end
of the week) with the idea that this was a serious "growing up"
moment for King David. He repented and grew in taking the
consequences. That's what's spinning around. Sara from Canada
Good Morning
The questions is asked, why did God take Bathsheba's child to punish
David. Is it that we really don't know what Bathsheba felt at the
lost of her child? What do you think?
Shalom
Pasthersyl
Pasthersyl,
Bathsheba is a very shadowy figure here. She says nothing. Obviously
a victim of sexual abuse in a patriarchal society. Or maybe not.
Later on, she is quite forthright in making sure that Solomon is the
next king. Maybe Bathsheba is a Jebusite. Maybe this is a political
marriage extending political opportunities for both David and
Bathsheba. We don't know how she felt about Uriah's death. In the
Richard Gere movie, "King David", we are led to believe that she was
glad to be rid of him. But that's Hollywood.
I'm not sure I understand your question, but it is clear that David
suffered horribly from the death of the child. Are you questioning
whether it is fair for Bathsheba to suffer the same punishment since
she is not the guilty party here?
Larry cny.
Larry
Thank you for responding back. I recently read a commentary asking
the question whether Bathsheba was unfairly treated by Yahweh in the
effort to punish David. So thought I would just share that concern
with the rest of the DPSers. It is relevant to my own hermeneutics
for this Sunday because I will be looking at the role of all four
participants (David, Bathsheba, Uriah and Nathan). I am looking at
Bathsheba as the silent partner in the affairs of the court. I know
it is only speculative, but I wonder could she have a twinge of
anger toward God (whether she followed Yahweh or not). Incidently,
I'm looking at Uriah's allegiance to his military career, his
patriotism, and Nathan's round-a-bout confrontation of David. This
is not a criticism of any, but a critique of relationships both
familial and spiritual. My effort is not to put down any of them,
but to objectively see how I've experience similar actions and
attitudes in my life. By seeing where their actions happen in my
life, I can then move under the guidance of the Holy Spirit to a new
place. I know this is probably more than you wanted to know in
response to your query, but this helped me to examine my own
hermeneutics.
Thanks
Shalom
Pasthersyl
I can't believe that Bathsheba is completely innocent of the affair,
but David was probably the instigator. She possibly might have set
him up, but probably not. We just don't know. I think she could have
said no at some point. But it was interesting to think of it as a
sexual harassment situation. Power does strange things to men. I
think probably she enjoyed the attention of the king through.
Again, there is so much that we don't know, but it's fun to
speculate. I have generally looked at this as a straightforward case
of David the king, middle aged, bored, looking for something new to
liven up his life. All the other kings have whatever and whoever
they want, why not him? Also, I don't think it's a big secret. The
palace messengers know about it, so probably the whole palace knows
about it. According to this view, Bathsheba has no say.
But lately, looking at Bathsheba's role in the succession narrative
in 2 Kings, she's not a helpless victim. She has a mind of her own
and brings her influence to bear upon public affairs.
It's worth noting that Jerusalem was conquered in a peaceful palace
coup. The city was not burned to the ground. The inhabitants were
not slaughtered. Instead, it became David's personal crown property.
The administration that was in place continued in place. Certainly
Araunah of 2 Sm 31 was an important Jebusite who continued on. Was
Uriah the Hittite also a holdover from the previous administration
who then became one of David's 30 mighty men? In the ancient near
east, marriage was often a political act, cementing an alliance with
another king. Maybe, (to put it bluntly) David is interested in
Bathsheba for more than her body. Maybe he is also interested in her
political connections. Maybe Bathsheba has more say in this than the
average woman of her time. Perhaps she is interested in David
because he is the new regime and their children will be kings.
Larry cny
Some of the conversation about Bathsheba's involvement makes me
think of "Blame the Victim" explainations. We can make up stories of
what she might have done, but from the Scripture it appears that she
was not involved, but sent for. If this is the first time David sees
her, how can she be involved? I find it hightly unlikely she was
trying to suduce anyone. I think we must be careful not to weave a
story that white washes the terrible things that David did. If we
do, we run the risk of harming women in our congregations who have
been raped and abused.
If she was angry with God after being raped and taken to King David,
it can be a healing process for women today. God can take our being
angry about things that happen to us that seem outside of God's
control, or even worse, sent by God. We as preachers need to clearly
say that abuse of any kind is inappropriate! mcp
Re the question about how to deal with the curse: In the wider
context of the overarching story of David, his descendants, and
Judah, I don't see this as God pronouncing a curse on the house of
David, but as God prounouncing the "fruit" of David's actions. I.E.,
the consequences of our sin have far reaching effects. This is a
good point to bring out in preaching this text. Ken in WV. P.S. May
all have a good Sunday and for the next 2 weeks after. I'm goin' to
the beach! Grace & Peace
I know this is late but I really wanted to respond. I think the
questions regarding Bathsheba, and whether she seduced David or was
willing detracts from the intent of the passage, and incorporates
the same denial that David used in taking her, then covering up by
murder. David and David alone was responsible. David and David alone
committed the sin, yet David's whole family and indeed all of Israel
suffered the harsh consequences. I even wonder if David had any
guilty feelings about it until Nathan's bringing the mirror of truth
to his face. We cannot deny or diminsh the sin of David without
diminishing the grace offered by God.
KD TX
mcp, yes of course this certainly seems like a clear cut case of
abuse. And our preaching tomorrow would be a good opportunity to
talk about sexual abuse. I hope I didn't come across as trying to
justify David's actions. We certainly should not sugar coat David's
sin. It does look like abusive relationship. But my point is that
there's lots of room for speculation, since the Deuteronomist is
writing several hundred years after the fact.
Happy preaching tomorrow, Larry cny
Of interest: There is an excellent article on David and Joab in this
month's Bible Review.
It takes Nathan, the mouthpiece of God, to "snap" David to his
senses. The prophet allows David to indict himself, to see himself
in the mirror. The prophet's method should be studied closely by
every minister--very pastoral. Had Nathan directly confronted David,
it is entirely possible the king would have become angry, defensive
and resistant to judgement. Yet, David's sense of ethics were intact
(albeit for others) therefore his indictment is irrefutable.
Nathan's curse is actually the curse David brings upon himself. His
infidelity toward the covenant is reflected in the infidelity of his
household. We reap what we sow. Our children learn by example, and
our attitudes and behaviors do not go unnoticed. Shalom, Fro.
I really failed to get started last week until Saturday afternoon,
and I had a funeral service for which I had to prepare for Sunday as
well. I want to get going earlier this week.
Back in 1976 CBS aired a series infomercials entitled, "You Were
There," to help us recall the history of our struggle for
independence and nation building. There is something about Nathan's
charge, "You the man" that makes me want to say "You were there and
you the man or you the woman." Relentlessly, our human nature drives
us to point fingers to the sins of others and fail to see the other
three that point back in our direction. TN Mack
Healing begins to take place as one becomes aware of one's sin.
Without awareness that one is sinful, then one cannot change what
one does not know.
David got a reality check by Nathan. What reality should we check on
for ourselves, our communities where we encounter each other's
ministries, our nation and our world?
As David faced his reality and became convinced that he
sinned..........He verbalized that sin through at
confession........and then changed to move on.
Does our confession each Sunday in our congregations make us change?
Why? Why not?
Just asking and seeking........
cs
My congregation has been following the lectionary reading from 1 and
2 Samuel and the life of David. We did a dramatic reading of a
theoretical phone call between King David and Dr. Laura Schlessinger
about his dilemma with Bathsheba. It was fun and we could see David
with all his flaws and his humanity. But this lectionary passage
brings some trouble for this female pastor. It appears to be
misogynistic in portraying God using David's wives for canon (no pun
intended) fodder. Any help out there? BB in IL
I get to use my sermon title "I am Tiger Woods" because Nathan gets
to say You Da Man!. Actually that is as about as far as I have
gotten. I know grace is going to be included and I am offering
communion this Sunday so I hope to end up with David's confession
being our call to the altar.
I like cs's questions about the reality check. Someone suggested to
me this week that we live in a hall of mirrors. We see reflections
of who we are from our co-workers and our performance evaluations,
from our friends and neighbors, and other sources. But, which of
those reflections is accurate? Some of them? All? None? The hall of
mirrors can distort things drastically -- at what point do we begin
to believe even a distorted reflection?
Nathan held up an accurate mirror to David and he didn't even
recognize himself until Nathan got really blunt. Whom do we trust to
give us an accurate reflection? Do we accept it when there are
blemishes or a few extra pounds? Still working this out. MTSOfan
Nathan would have been a good C.P.E. supervisor. I remember my own
residency from a decade ago with "fear and trembling," i.e., those
Interpersonal Relationship Groups, supervision sessions, etc. There
would be a lot of "parabolic" discussions and then you'd get
"zinged"! However, Nathan would have been good b/c I sense that
restoration was his goal, not judgment. We could learn from him.
EcclesialMan in NC
Was wondering this morning if David would have messed up so badly if
Jonathon had still been living. If Jonathon was truly a friend,
would he have helped keep David straight? It seems that David had no
one in his life that held him accountable, except Nathan after the
fact, and led to him having a distorted sense of entitlement. "All
the other kings get to do what they want." To his credit, when
Nathan confronted him, he remembered that he was held to a higher
level of accountability than what all the other kings were doing.
Jim H in SC
BB in IL I think it is something that females of faith continue to
wrestle with. I suppose we have to ask ourselves whether we continue
to be used as "canon foder," As you called it, or do we standup for
what is right and liberate the memories of our foremothers. We let
God direct us in new liberation from those images of the past. I've
also wrestled with the inevitability of being attracted to another
human. Was David's (and Bathsehba's response)sin in the attraction,
or what they did with the attraction?
Shalom
Pasthersyl (now retired, preferring now to being called bammamma)
