I'm sure you're already cautious of this, but we must be careful not
to "Christianize" the OT. Perhaps Isaiah was prophesying the coming
of Christ or the end times according to Xian tradition, but the
challenge is taking Isaiah for what it is, not what it may be
through Xian, 20th century eyes.
The tie in to the Eucharist is wonderful-rich food, love, God,
wine-all prepared by God for all people. GO for it!
Peace,
Julie at ANTS
Julie at ANTS (and what is ANTS by the way),
I pray that you are kidding when you say that we must not
Christianize the OT. Did not Christ quote the OT time and again? Did
He not point out how He is the fulfillment of the Law and the
Prophets?
The OT points and foretells the NT. The Isaiah passages in
particular.
I believe you should be careful not to paganize or secularize the
Bible.
Rick in Va
Rick in Virginia, I think you misunderstand Julie at ANTS. She can
speak for herself, but I don't think she was suggesting that the OT
should never be seen through the lenses of faith in Christ, but that
it has its own identity as God's self-revelation without having to
see it in all ways as a reference to Jesus. To see v.9, for example,
as a pre-figuring of the coming of Christ rather than as Isaiah's
vision of the coming Kingdom of God (which we are all still
awaiting) is to divest it of its historical significance and some of
its power and richness for our faith. Because I am like Paul, and
understand things dimly as though looking through an imperfect
mirror, I try to understand the truth of God as witnessed by the
writers of both OT and NT as they understood things in their own
times. Though many things can be seen as pointing to Christ, there
is a rich witness to God in the OT without having to interpret
everything solely in Christian terms.
As for me, I love the imagery with which Isaiah describes the coming
Kingdom of God. With Mt. Zion as its centerpiece, the LORD will
prepare a great feast, not just for the rich and powerful but for
all people. No more will the reality of death obscure our vision and
inhibit our living, nor will any be sad or hurt. Now that's some
party Isaiah sees. It speaks to a joy-filled God who is determined
that we mortals should also be joy-filled and fulfilled in every way
-- that we should share in the joy and wonder and goodness of God's
eternal celebration of life. My God!
Jim in the Blue Ridge
First, ANTS is Andover Newton Theological School.
Second, Thank you Jim for understanding what I said. The Hebrew
scriptures have their own integrity seperate from the New Testament
and saying that is NOT an attempt at "Paganizing or secularizing the
Bible". Sorry, Rick in VA, if you disagree, but read a little closer
into what I said before you lable me a "paganizer".
Julie at ANTS
Julie at ANTS,
Where is that?
And please re-read my post. I believe I said you should be careful
not to paganize, I did not label you a paganizer.
The question I posed however hasn't been answered.
How does Jim, or Julie or ANTS for that matter, deal with Jesus'
extensive quotations of the Old Testament? Is He guilty of
'Christianizing' the Old Testament?
Rick in Va
I have no doubt that Jesus showed us how to look upon the OT with
new eyes. These were the texts Jesus himself grew up reading and
studying. He even quoted himself when referring to his ministry (all
of his ministry from the nativity to Easter). Christians believe
that the OT prophets were referring to Jesus as the Messiah, Jews
believe that the prophets were referring to a Messiah who has yet to
come. Plain and simple.
As a Christian I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and is the one
whom God was speaking of through the prophets. Also as a Christian I
can read an OT text and appreciate it within its context, not as
simply a foundation for the Church to stand upon which is only
appreciated in comparison to the NT. Its is the history of the human
relationship with God and does not need to be validated by its
ability to prophesy the coming of Christ.
To simply answer Rick in VA's question and to state the obvious,
Jesus quoted the OT because he was a Jew, making it impossible for
him to Christianize the OT because he wasn't a Christian.
Peace,
Julie at ANTS (which is outside Boston and is the oldest Protestant
seminary in the country)
Thanks for the ANTS info Julie.
Of course Jesus wasn't a Christian. However, I hope that He is the
object of a Christian's faith. And as such, ought to carry a lot of
weight when he points to the OT as that which foretells His purpose,
His coming, His salvation.
As the object of our faith, we ought to emulate that which He
taught. We ought to apply it. We ought to live by it.
That is not Christianizing the OT as you have put it. However it is
reading the OT from the perspective that Christ taught. And in that
sense, we are to Christ-ize the OT.
Rick in Va
Like Julie at ANTS, I can see this text for its purpose...to alert
all tat God is willing, and able, to destroy the shroud above all
peoples, in all situations; even the destruction such as from
hurrican Floyd. How do you present God to someone who has been
flooded out of home for three weeks? How do you preach to a people
who have lived through the blast? It is that God, who is maker of
the storm, also is above, beyond, apart that same storm, yet with
the people in wiping away tears, providing the banquet, swallowing
up death. This may not be immediately grasped by those who have not
been through a hurricane, tornado, earthquake, etc, but to us who
have, it is amazing how God-fearing people don't see God in the
destruction, ruin and death, but in the aftermath of helping hands,
of free delivered food and people who pray. That is the strength of
this passage. Doug in Bahamas
