Scroll further down for the 2001 discussion of this text
2000 Discussion:
Date: 29 May 2000
Time: 06:42:16
The striking thing for me this week, as with the past two week's readings in Acts, is that instead of celebrating the season of Easter with resurrection appearances Like Years A and B, we've been having a three week processional march toward Pentecost. Two weeks ago, the Spirit was busy with Philip and the Ethiopian Eunuch, essentially including the strangest sort of outsider. This past week at Cornelius' house again the Spirit is busy, this time "terrifying" the "beleiver" by falling "even on the Gentiles." Just another episode in the work of the Spirit tearing the roof off the church to let the outsiders in.
This week, for some reason, we flashing back in Acts to Jesus' departure/ascension and his promise of the coming of the Spirit (but she's been here for the past two weeks).
I'm not asking for an explanation, I understand the lectionary, but it's an odd step back to say get ready because next week ("not many days from now") the Spirit is coming. While, for two weeks we've been surprised and terrified by what she's already doing.
No real helpful comment here, just some thoughts on how to transition back.
Kelly in WA
Date: 29 May 2000
Time: 11:27:14
What is the geography of ascension? Did Jesus go up? Go out? I think I'm going to suggest that the Ascension is "In"? Jesus ceases to be a visible, tangible presence, so that he may become an inner reality. Thus the promise of the Spirit is implicit in the ascension experience -- whether historic or mythic. The greater reality is what happened in Jerusalem a week or so later -- and what happens to and in us daily. Ole Fogey in NJ
Date: 30 May 2000
Time: 21:45:16
Famous lasts words- You will be my witnesses. One thing Jesus cannot do is be his own witness. We are so valuable. It is such a blessing to know that you are needed, and important. We have all been called to be his witness and we are happiest when we are doing what we are called to do. Maybe it is time we get our instructions (vs.2) and go do our job (vs.8) RT in So.Car.
Date: 02 Jun 2000
Time: 00:59:36
Ole Fogey: Thank you for your insight. I have named my sermon "Where did He Go?" Too often I think we get too tied up with the where question that we forget to ask the what-for one. You hit both on the head! "In" seems to be the right response. Thanks for jogging my thoughts! Don in Charleston
Date: 02 Jun 2000
Time: 13:48:29
I'm fascinated by a few things in this passage, and haven't decided how I'll follow up with any or all of them in my sermon yet! I'm curious about the reference to Jesus appearing over 40 days--obvious Exodus connotations here. The wilderness as a training period? People being prepared for being God's chosen in the promised land? The Israelites went through periods of doubting and outright rebellion during the wilderness wanderings--perhaps we can extrapolate that the disciples (in their larger-than-12 grouping) may have also had periods of doubting, if not outright rebellion (cf Peter's denial before Jesus was crucified). I'm serving as an interim pastor towards the end of the interim--I think there's some valuable connections there.
What about the disciples asking if Jesus is going to 'restore the kingdom to Israel?' They still just don't get it! Is Jesus ever about politics? I struggle with this one a lot. We tend to hoist him like a flag when it suits our needs, but I don't see much evidence of that being Jesus' main concern. Are we also asking "are you going to restore the kingdom..." and not always meaning God's realm but something with more political foundation?
When Jesus tells the disciples that they will "receive power," there's a wonderful irony there, given the question that they just asked. Sure, they'll receive power, but it won't be the kind of power they might be expecting; and it will actually call them to be servants rather than military/political leaders. Are we prepared for that ourselves?
Given that, I'd like to follow up a little bit more on what Jesus means when he says "you will be my witnesses." I know what I assume, given our modern-day usage of that term, but in Jesus' time would it have had a court-room connotation? Any relation to the military or political powers? Has anyone done a word study on "witness" recently?
What about the two men dressed in white? Lk 24:4--are these the same men? Similar dress, and similar questioning pattern. "Why do you look for the living among the dead" vis-a-vis "Why do you stand here looking into the sky?" Similar follow-up statement as well. This sets up the ascension as a second resurrection, if you will. Another phase of Jesus' relationship with those of us still wearing flesh.
Finally, of course, the phrase upon which I based my sermon title ("Don't Just Stand There!") for bulletin purposes several days ago, without really knowing what I was actually going to preach...(!)... "Why do you stand here looking into the sky?" Given contemporary culture, I almost fall into the cliche of Nike's 'Just do it,' although I'll resist because it's too expected. But there's a good swift kick in the pants to get out and do ministry, rather than just standing around waiting for something significant to happen. Again, for my congregation in the interim period, when the strongest temptation is to stand around looking into the sky, some strong direction is given here.
Those are my unorganized and various thought processes on a Friday morning--I'll check in again tomorrow afternoon when I sit down to start putting together my sermon! I always find inspiration from this discussion even if I rarely post anything myself! Sandy from NY
Date: 02 Jun 2000
Time: 15:10:01
I think we make to much of the Ascension itself. As several notable scholars put it, Scripture itself pays little notice of the event. Yet, we dedicate a full day to it (or more).
As to where Jesus went. Unless we link it to the Trinitarian formula, I struggle with Jesus going in us. Certainly, we pray that the Holy Spirit will be upon us. But, that Jesus us is in us smacks of panentheism and individual religious experiences. "I am returning to the Father" not "I'm going in your heart." I don't want to domesticate the power of this event and the coming of the Spirit to an individual moment. It happens in community, it happens when we are in ministry together.
I think my focus will be on the in between time (now and not yet) of Easter and Pentecost. Jesus has left them. The Spirit has not come. Now what? According to the formula here and in the Luke reading it's: wait, worship and witness (a bit trite but www). This is as one commentary pointed out, the advent of Pentecost. They/we are waiting after Jesus' ascension, to receive the Holy Spirit. We don't know what that means, what form it will take, what it will do to us, but we are faithful and joyful in our waiting, worship and witness. (No, I'm not really suggesting that we don't know what the H. Spirit will be like, it has come in Pentecost, but I do think some of us in the congregation are still waiting to be clothed in power and the fulfillment of the promise from the Father.)
So much for now.
Kelly in WA
Date: 02 Jun 2000
Time: 20:56:19
Philip Yancey in his book: The Jesus I Never Knew said he struggles with the reason for the ascension. He doesn't understand why Jesus left it up to us, the church. But he compares it to John 12:24 (grain dying producing much fruit) saying trying to kill the faith by killing Jesus is much like trying to kill a dandelion by blowing on the seeds.
I feel the ascension is significant because Now Jesus is not bound to time and space. Even in a resurrected body he would not be for all through all in all and above all as Paul points out. I mean if he was in an office somewhere we could go to him or e-mail him with every dispute, but he'd probably tell us something like he did to the brother: "Who died and made me your power of attorney?" LUke 12:14 and we would walk away confused. Just a thought. Musing in TX
Date: 03 Jun 2000
Time: 03:11:49
My sermon will also be about Jesus asking the disciples to wait: in the in-between time, in the meantime. It seems to me that the big temptation for the disciples was to either go back to the familiar, their jobs, their homes or to lunge into, create, and make happen the kind of future they had perceived. Maybe a revolution, or form a task force.
But, Jesus tells them to wait in Jerusalem. A place where kingdoms have come and gone during the time of its history. The word-name 'Jerusalem', by the way, means 'flowing peace.' Maybe, it is during the inbetween times of our lives that things seem the most fluid and the least concrete. It is in the midst of all that 'flowing', that floating time, when peace does its best work. Jerusalem: flowing peace.In the midst of waiting. And, am also pondering what, if any, the significance is of them waiting 'together.'
Could it be that the power thing will be radically different. No 'anointing' for just the king,or the priest. But, the anointing, the coming of the Spirit, will be a collective happening. A new thing. A counter-cultural thing. Do they need time to get ready for this new thing? pondering
PN/GA
Date: 03 Jun 2000
Time: 03:11:56
My sermon will also be about Jesus asking the disciples to wait: in the in-between time, in the meantime. It seems to me that the big temptation for the disciples was to either go back to the familiar, their jobs, their homes or to lunge into, create, and make happen the kind of future they had perceived. Maybe a revolution, or form a task force.
But, Jesus tells them to wait in Jerusalem. A place where kingdoms have come and gone during the time of its history. The word-name 'Jerusalem', by the way, means 'flowing peace.' Maybe, it is during the inbetween times of our lives that things seem the most fluid and the least concrete. It is in the midst of all that 'flowing', that floating time, when peace does its best work. Jerusalem: flowing peace.In the midst of waiting. And, am also pondering what, if any, the significance is of them waiting 'together.'
Could it be that the power thing will be radically different. No 'anointing' for just the king,or the priest. But, th
Date: 03 Jun 2000
Time: 03:12:08
My sermon will also be about Jesus asking the disciples to wait: in the in-between time, in the meantime. It seems to me that the big temptation for the disciples was to either go back to the familiar, their jobs, their homes or to lunge into, create, and make happen the kind of future they had perceived. Maybe a revolution, or form a task force.
But, Jesus tells them to wait in Jerusalem. A place where kingdoms have come and gone during the time of its history. The word-name 'Jerusalem', by the way, means 'flowing peace.' Maybe, it is during the inbetween times of our lives that things seem the most fluid and the least concrete. It is in the midst of all that 'flowing', that floating time, when peace does its best work. Jerusalem: flowing peace.In the midst of waiting. And, am also pondering what, if any, the significance is of them waiting 'together.'
Could it be that the power thing will be radically different. No 'anointing' for just the king,or the priest. But, the anointing, the coming of the Spirit, will be a collective happening. A new thing. A counter-cultural thing. Do they need time to get ready for this new thing? pondering
PN/GA
Date: 03 Jun 2000
Time: 11:58:13
Just working on my sermon for Ascension right now (fun! fun! fun! - not) :)
I'm tackling two elements: 1. Where did Jesus go (given our understanding of the universe - beyond the sky, space etc) and why did he go this way?
After the resurrection Jesus body had changed in certain aspects in that he was able to appear and disappear to various people. By ascending in the way that he did he was not showing that above the skies was heaven (to put it simply) but I think that he needed some tangible way to show the disciples that he wouldn't be back (well, not in the form that he had done in his resurrection appearances). It was an enacted symbol to show that this was the last time he would be with them in a visible/physical manner.
2. I want to emphasise the passage: "Why stand looking into the sky" In other words, telling the disciples to get on with it rather than preoccupy themselves with gazing into heaven (or even navel-gazing) - not too be "too heavenly minded that they are no earthly use" - to get on with living. This theme is repeated in a sense throughout the scriptures with people experiencing something of God's glory (the wise men, the shepherds, the disciples during the transfiguration etc etc list is huge) and then getting back to normal life - except their lives will be different for their experience will have changed them - giving them insight, liberation, challenge and inspiration.
OK - all for now - back to the sermon :)
Blessings Shirley
Discussion from 1999:
My Goodness, is no one preaching on Acts this week? Many churches do not have a special service on the 13th to honour the ascension. It needs to be addressed during the worship on Sunday.
The Ascension is so often ignored and completely overlooked, however, because of Jesus' ascension, we have the gift of the holy spirit! The word of God reaches each corner of the earth. If anyone is preaching on the ascension, I would love to hear from you. I will check out the Acts 1: 6-14 site. Rev.WW
Rev WW, I am just finishing my research on the Acts 1 text coupled with the Lukan text. I am fascinated with the differnet messages "Luke" presents in the two books. Will come back by Friday with the results of my research.
Notice the shift of attention. Kinda like the passing of the mantle from Elijah to Elisha. Disciples ask: "Lord is this the time YOU will restore the Kingdom to Israel?" Jesus responds; "YOU will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and YOU will be my witnessess in...."
So, "Why do you stand around looking up?"
pHil
Notice the shift of attention. Kinda like the passing of the mantle from Elijah to Elisha. Disciples ask: "Lord is this the time YOU will restore the Kingdom to Israel?" Jesus responds; "YOU will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and YOU will be my witnessess in...."
So, "Why do you stand around looking up?"
pHil
The disciples couldn't have mistaken the circumstances of Jesus' leave taking. The Shekinah glory of God most often was shown as a pillar of cloud. Jesus is going to be with the Father - and in John, Jesus promises his return as our empowerment! Ken in WV
2001 Discussion:
Date: 22 May 2001
Time: 22:55:39
I seem to be alone in using this scripture for Sunday. I am struck by the promise to receive power to be witnesses to all the ends of the earth. maybe it's because we used to sing a song, "Ye Shall be my Witnesses" Another thing I'm struck by at this point is that the Ascension marks Jesus' return in glory. How do we give Him glory? How do we make Him our Lord?
rachel
Date: 23 May 2001
Time: 02:46:33
I like this scripture...it interests me that this version is different then the Luke passage, yet they are supposedly written by the same author.
The disciples question Jesus and still don't understand his purpose. They ask, "Are you now going to restore the kingdom of Israel now?" As if Jesus whole purpose was to restore the kingdom and empire of Israel. Jesus wasn't about that and still isn't. Jesus was about restoring souls and building lives. He was here to bring comfort, peace and a WAY of life that leads to everlasting.
At the end the disciples are still looking up. Two men appear and say to them, Why are you still looking up? Jesus will appear like he left in glory. Why are we still looking up? Trying to find Jesus....he is here in glory. Here where ever God's love, comfort, peace and Way are found. Why are we still looking up?
Just some thoughts, RB in NC
Date: 23 May 2001
Time: 16:09:15
I'm still looking up because the Kingdom isn't going to be consumated until He returns. I'm still looking up because the glory here and now isn't worth comparing what is in store for me. I'm looking up and longing for the day when I don't have to do another funeral. I'm looking up and waiting for the day when the only tears that will be shed will be those of everlasting joy. I'm looking up because He's coming back in the same manner that He left.
The Comforter may be here but He's just a down payment on my Glory Account. I don't want only to be comforted, I want to be all God's planned me to be. I'm tired of looking through the dark glass. I want to see even as I am fully seen by Him.
So I'm looking east, looking for a face in the sky.
Maranatha, Lord Jesus!
John near Pitts.
Date: 24 May 2001
Time: 13:48:31
I agree that we continue to long for Jesus' return to bring about God's kingdom, but for many as in my congregation, they look up because they do not see Jesus here around them. We live and often believe that God is distant, foreign and has nothing to do with our messy world. Jesus is not only going to return but is already among us as we witness in his name. We witness to the glory of Jesus in the dark and often dim places of life.
RB in NC
Date: 24 May 2001
Time: 15:44:41
The Spirit of the Living God, the Third person of the Trinity, co-equal, co-eternal to be equally worshipped and glorified, the Spirit of Christ, the power which empowers the Church--a downpayment? Ah for the Spirit of Truth!
rr
Date: 25 May 2001
Time: 12:27:44
RB The Kindom is for everyone, no longer reserved for the tribes. It is to be taken every where. The disciples really fail to understand that, just as we do today when we ignore and outcast those who are culturally different. Our comfort is also found in being the hands of Jesus. The question from the angels refocuses our attention to the work on earth. NC
Date: 25 May 2001
Time: 12:38:16
rr:
Not that the Spirit is the downpayment but the Spirit's presence in our lives is the downpayment i.e. just the very tip of the iceberg. Yes, the co-equal, co-eternal God is with us, but if you think this is something, you "ain't" seen "nothing" yet!
RB in NC: I'd save those thoughts for next week's focus on Pentecost, the outpouring of the Comforter, God come down and within. I think your points would fit better with God returning than the emphasis of this week's going away and the promise to return.
Just my nickel's worth,
John near Pitts.
John near Pitts.
Date: 25 May 2001
Time: 13:31:15
I've been thinking about the limited vision of the disciples. Isn't that our problem too.
rachel
Date: 25 May 2001
Time: 20:24:13
In New York City we mark the importance of religious holidays by whether or not alternate-side-of-the-street parking is suspended that day. According to New York City parking regulations, the Ascension of the Lord is an important Christian holiday, though I am sure the churches were not packed with street sweepers on Thursday.
I'm going to talk about the Ascension as an affirmation of the universality of Christ. Can we affirm that without being chauvinistic? In the Presbyterian Church these days, the "Confessing Church Movement" wants to make all leaders confess they believe that Jesus is the ONLY way to salvation. Can't we affirm The sovereignty of Christ without limited God's grace to our own understanding of it?
DGinNYC
Date: 27 May 2001
Time: 03:32:31
I am preaching on the sovereignty of God based on Acts 1:7. Ultimately this is God's answer to all our "why" questions. We do not have all the answers most of the time. It is God's will seems to be the bottom line. Tony from Brooklyn