Just doing some advance work. How about considering that the selection fo David was important to the people of the time, but just as important to the lineage of Jesus in Matthew? Our time is brief by comparsion, our church's live on long after we are gone, but in our time what are we doing to be faithful to our calling to continue the work of our savior? Are we a special theological link that will bear fruit 24 generations down the line? REVJDI
The Lord does not look at our earthly value of strength, beauty or being the elder in our families or communities. Being a shepherd or the youngest was not the highest position among the Jewish culture. But the Lord selected David. Sometimes in our communities we think that because we are the oldest or more prominent parties we are closer to God. Wrong! That person sitting last and really praying in a humble manner is closer to God and God will annoint him with his eternal love. Joe
samuel anointed david while, to the world, saul was still king. i'm working on the notion that the church is anointed to do God's will but the world thinks that its way is still king. what do you think? sue
Dear friends, The main points of this text are clear and interesting, but several things occur that are also intriguing and not frequently noted: The first one- I have questions about is the response of the elders of the town upon the arrival of Samual, "Do you come in peace?" they asked in fear and trembling. The second one- God said, "I have provided for myself a king among his sons." I'd be curious to hear the thoughts and/or midrash of others about these two parts of the text Faithfully, TCCStend
David's the eighth son and he's out in the field with the sheep. Seven's the Bible's big completion number, which makes eight, the leftovers, extra, not as important etc, the least one. Traditional baptismal fonts have 8 sides, cuz God created the world in 7 days and the new creation of the kingdom is the eighth day of creation...any thoughts on this trail...? Pam in Tampa
Pam in Tampa.
Pam in Tampa.
Pam in Tampa (once more): I think the traditional eight sides of the baptismal font have more to do with the eight who were saved from the flood (I Peter 3:20) rather than the new creation -- at least I don't know any biblical reference to eight as a sign of the new creation. The choosing of David (especially as the reading to accompany this week's gospel) strikes me more as the selection of someone the world would not choose -- i.e. "the baby." Is that theme not echoed in the judgment of the religious authorities of Jesus' day that he was a "sinner" and could not possibly have brought about the blind man's healing? For what it's worth. Glenn in Pictou NS Canada
tccstend, to your first point of why the villagers of Bethlehem would be afraid when Samuel, the king's representative, came to town:
since saul has become king, he has led israel into many battles recovering lost land and even pushing the back the borders. to win those battles, he needed soldiers, money, and food. thus, when the king's man comes to town, the villagers assume that he has come for one or more of these. sue
tccstend, as to your second point of the Lord's choice of a new king: Saul was the son of a prominent family. he himself was tall and handsome. perfect choice for a king--he was used to being in charge and he looked the part. the world tends to be influenced by the way things appear.
God sends Samuel to Bethlehem, an unimportant village. He picks the family of Jesse, who as far as we know is an unimportant man. then he chooses the least important son of the eighth, one overlooked by his family to the extent that he has not even been included in the festivities that day. God chooses the weak, the unimportant, the despised.
e.g., Compare the Hebrew slaves in Egypt with their masters. "The Lord does not see as mortals see."
Not to be obnoxious, but I looked up I peter 3:20 and it says specifically 8 "saved through water". I Peter 3:21 continues, "Baptism,which corresponds to this, now saves you..." and isn't the church the new testament equivalent of the ark which saved the 8 from the waters of Chaos? And are we not new creations in Christ Jesus?. Glenn, seems you have added to the case that 8 was important.. we keep at this I could have a whole sermon by Tuesday! -Pam
A Hawaiian parallel is the calling of Umi to be king in the 1500's. He was a humble half-brother to the king's eldest son, who inherited the throne. When the eldest brother's reign became one of terror and vanity, Umi left to seek an annonymous simple life near Lapahoehoe, working the taro fields and fish farms. The local priest (okay, not a Christian) noticed the frequent rainbows over Umi's hut, and took this as a sign, adopting him in the Hawaiian tradition of 'hanai'. When the high-level priests came visiting, they found the local priest gone for the day, in the field with the people. A simple servant prepareed for them a vast feast and a pleasant nap. They exclaimed, "Finally in our old age we have tasted a little comfort!" When the local priest returned, they stood with him in the door way, pointing out each returning worker, asking if he might be the returning 'hanai' son. None was. Finally they asked, "Where is your son?" "Ah," said the local priest, "it is he who served you." (Umi went on to be a great king.)
A bishop of my denom. has developed a thesis that God was being revealed to native peoples in various parts of the world, not just Israel. (Although clearly the Israelites were highly receptive, others a bit more confused.) This bishop is himself of Native American ancestry, and points out the parallels in his own culture. This is not to minimize the Word as we understand it in the Old Testament, but to point out that to some extent, the seeking of other peoples was not in vain. I realize that this is a radical departure, and probably outside the theology of most. But if we suspend our discomfort, an approach that acknowledges the thirst of God's people from the beginning, wherever they were, may be superior to one that says, "Your people were wrong, 100%. Leave your heritage completely and take on another completely."
In any case, I offer Umi as a gift....
HW in HI
Eugene Peterson's book, "Leap Over a Wall," has a chapter on this passage that I would reccommend. Peterson uses David as an example of how God works (often, usually) through those who, by the world's standards at least, would not be seen as those most likely to succeed.
The powerful point that Peterson makes is that David is a "layperson." He was not born in a great family. He was not educated at the finest schools. He was not the first born, but, the eighth.In fact he was relegated to do the kind of work where he couldn't mess anything up or get in the way, tending the sheep.
Peterson challenges each of us to find the part of David that God has instilled in each of us, as the priesthood of believers, to do God's work.
Part of the problem with today's world is that we rely on too many experts. We trust experts with our health, money, relations, and with our faith. It is easy to cross the line where we are no longer feel personally responsible for much of what we do.
When we have health problems we ask an expert. Which is good except for the fact that many of our problems are caused by our own refusal to take responsibility for our own good health in the first place.
This passage gives us a wonderful opportunity to remind our laypeople that they can and in fact are called to do God's work.
ROG in NC
You may want to take a look at Walter Bruegemann's book, Texts Under Negotiation, where he discusses this text. He says that this story is told to demonstrate that while we give authority to legitimized power, God often chooses to bestow power on the disenfranchised - those who have no power. Our world may not be as settled and established as we like to think. The wind of God surges and something genuinely new is wrought on the earth - disestablishing the established and empowering the humble.
BS in OR
You may want to take a look at Walter Bruegemann's book, Texts Under Negotiation, where he discusses this text. He says that this story is told to demonstrate that while we give authority to legitimized power, God often chooses to bestow power on the disenfranchised - those who have no power. Our world may not be as settled and established as we like to think. The wind of God surges and something genuinely new is wrought on the earth - disestablishing the established and empowering the humble.
BS in OR
Eighth Day - The eight sides of the baptismal font has to do with the new covenant. Baptism in correlation to circumcision where Jews males were brought on the eighth day to have the sign/mark of the covenant. The flood story is interesting in this regards to covenant and new beginnings. Is that not what God was doing in David, establishing a new beginning and a covenant with Israel? This is an interesting angle!
Kingdom DJ
DJ, I'm still on this 8/baptism/new covenant thing. Now add to the mix "annointing" Sam thinks Eliab might be the Lord's annointed...even before he's hauled out the oil; and when Sam does annoint David God's spirit is with him "from that day forward" In baptism we are annointed with water, and in some traditions with oil. In my tradition we pronounce,"you are marked as Christ's own and sealed with the holy spirit forever." Definately a new creation occuring. Anyone got anymore on the annointing angle? Pam -Tpa
A good sermon title for the Samuel passage is: "Pretty Is As Pretty Does." This is an expression my mother-in-law would tell my wife when she was a teenager when she would be dressed to the nines and would be going out on a date. R. East -- Brandenburg, Kentucky
Sue earlier offered,
"samuel anointed david while, to the world, saul was still king. i'm working on the notion that the church is anointed to do God's will but the world thinks that its way is still king."
I agree, Sue. But let me play devil's advocate here and suggest that it would be just as true to say that God annoints whoever God wants to, but the Church thinks that ITS way is still king.
Remember the gospel reading: When we say, 'We see,' it is THEN that we are truly blind.
Rick in Canada, eh?
Rick, are there people in the church who really have the world, not God as their reference point? One woman complained to me when I suggested we may not baptize her grandson since her son lived 300 miles away and clearly admitted not having been inside a church in 20 years, "Well, I don't see any problem, when I wanted my son baptised we just came to the church, and it was such a nice ceremony!" The comment goes of course to the efficacy of the sacrament, but also perhaps God's annointing is "secret", not just a nice public ceremony. Pam in Tpa
Anybody else think that this sounds like a beauty pageant, with the sons of Jesse parading before the Judge? And why, after hearing that God is concerned with the heart, not outward appearance, does the text tell nothing about David's heart, describing only his physical appearance? Joe in VA
Anybody else think that this sounds like a beauty pageant, with the sons of Jesse parading before the Judge? And why, after hearing that God is concerned with the heart, not outward appearance, does the text tell nothing about David's heart, describing only his physical appearance? Joe in VA
Does God totally reject the other seven brothers? Or just not choose them to be king? In God's kingdom isn't there something for everyone to do? That is a message I've been trying to preach to a rather "Sundays only" church. Do our hearts have to be "right" before we can serve? Fisher in TN
Hi all!
Fisher in TN asked... "Do our hearts have to be "right" before we can serve?"
The answer, of course, is "of course not!" But maybe that's what is behind the point that Joe makes in his question...
"Why, after hearing that God is concerned with the heart, not outward appearance, does the text tell nothing about David's heart, describing only his physical appearance?"
The point of the story is not getting our hearts "right with God," or preparing ourselves to meet our maker, or getting our lives in order so when Jesus comes back we'll be doing the right things, or obedience, or even faith, or anything else along these lines.
The point is God choosing whom God chooses to choose! And, as has been pointed out before, God chooses to choose the ones that no body else would even THINK of choosing!
Sounds like, "You did not choose me, butI chose you and appointed you...."
Rick in Canada, eh?